00:00How much do you want to spend half the time? The answer is I don’t have a

00:04budget. And my answer is you’re full of

00:07>> That’s Steve Vasano, the founder of the jet business, the world’s first and only

00:11street level aviation showroom for commercial jet aircrafts.

00:14>> Steve’s brokered over 300 corporate jet deals over the last 30 years to the

00:20likes of Tony Robbins and Frank Sinatra, totaling over 4 billion US. 30 years

00:26ago, the average age of a CEO of a company buying an airplane was probably

00:30in his late 60s. Today, that person is probably in his late 40s. So, that adds

00:35so many more people into the market.

00:38>> This is a complete masterass with the world’s number one expert on jet

00:41purchasing and how to do it without falling into the biggest traps. The

00:45biggest mistake buyers make is to have their in-house counsel say, “Go

00:48negotiate this.” Big, big, big mistake. Today you’ll learn the sweet spot where

00:53purchasing a jet is financially wise.

00:55>> If you’re flying 200 hours a year, I can pretty much show you how I can get you

01:0130 more days in the office a year.

01:04>> Wow.

01:05>> The top mistakes you need to avoid.

01:07>> If you really want an airplane today that’s less than 5 years old, you good

01:11luck. Some people decide on which airplane they want to buy by the color

01:16of the seats. It’s really bizarre and it is so not how to buy a jet 101 and

01:23what’s coming next to the industry. A passenger carrying drone that is going

01:27to be huge.

01:32>> How’s it going guys?

01:34>> Good. Good. Full Hollywood right now.

01:39>> Steve, it’s great to have you here. Thank you so much.

01:41>> Much thanks for the invitation. For anybody listening and not watching, we

01:45are in the showroom of one of the most remarkable businesses in the world.

01:48That’s the jet business in London. So, we’re in this amazing meeting room in a

01:54fuselage on Park Lane. I’m around the corner from the famous aviation wall.

02:00Have you got a name for that?

02:01>> Yeah, the video wall. The video.

02:02>> The video wall.

02:03>> You know, it’s an actual life-size fuselage on Park Lane in the heart of

02:08London. It’s amazing.

02:10>> Yeah. Listen, I mean, we try to get into passing traffic to get shocked when they

02:14drive by and see the showroom and get them to come in. And you know, once you

02:17get them to come in, hit them with the video wall and inside the video walls

02:20all the data. So, it’s really the environment, the technology, and the

02:25information. Those are the three sort of legs to the stool. In saying that,

02:29there’s two really interesting things. One is you’re an American who decided to

02:34open up a jet business in London. and two, you’ve created this magnificent

02:41space. Walk us through those two decisions because you’re clearly not

02:44somebody who takes the normal path.

02:47>> Let me tell you, every time I write a check for the rent, I I keep telling

02:50myself that.

02:54>> Yeah.

02:54>> Yeah. It’s it is it is really, you know, 90,000 vehicles a year drive by here.

03:02And we calculated that uh each day there are 40 people who own a jet that pass by

03:08this window.

03:09>> Wow.

03:09>> Wow.

03:10>> How did you calculate that?

03:11>> We figured out we we did is we did a calculation that how many you know

03:15millionaires are how many jets there are owned by you know the people in the UK

03:19and we took the number of the cars going by and

03:22>> wow

03:23>> and and half of the 40 are different.

03:26>> So they got the same 20 every day that come by live here. There’s 20 that

03:30actually come in and go out of town every day that are are different people,

03:34which is key to being here. I could be on Barkley Square, which is an

03:38incredible location. All the private equity firms and everybody there, but

03:41it’s the same people every day. If

03:43>> we go back to the very beginning, can you talk us through the first jet you

03:46sold?

03:47>> Yeah. Well, I was 23 years old and um I was working as a lobbyist on Capitol

03:54Hill and representing the airplane manufacturers. It was a great job, but

03:59you know the ego was satisfied because I was walking through the halls of

04:02Congress and Senate and you know really just talking with the heads of the of

04:08the US government and a lot of heads of industries and things like that and it

04:12was a fantastic ego boost but the financial reumination was terrible. I

04:17was I mean literally I was making $13,000 a year

04:21>> and we had a company plane that I was able to use and fly myself

04:25>> if I wanted to and the only deal was you had to pay for the gas. I couldn’t even

04:30afford to pay for the gas. So, um, so I got a job at night and I and I in a

04:34nightclub that my roommate owned and, uh, basically met a guy who sold jets

04:39and he started coming in there showing off all these paycheck paychecks,

04:43commission checks he was making. And finally, I convinced him to meet his

04:46boss and got a job working there for free. Uh, cuz they said, “You never sold

04:51airplanes before. Why why would I hire you?” So, I convinced him to hire me for

04:55free with no, you know, no exposure, financial exposure. And it took me about

04:59nine months of working there for free waiting tables at night in a restaurant

05:04to pay my rent. Uh and then finally uh after nine months I had my first

05:09transaction and this was to a South American uh billionaire. Uh and in news

05:16those days a billionaire was very rare. I mean it was uh it was sort of like

05:21talking to you know like Elon Musk or somebody of today. And we signed a deal.

05:26At the time it was a $3.1 million airplane, which equivalent today is like

05:31$50 million. And I, you know, I’ve never been on a private jet myself. I was

05:35trying to sell them, but I never really was ever on one. And we signed a deal.

05:40And in America, there’s certain states that you take delivery in, so you don’t

05:44have to pay a certain tax. So this place we closed in North Carolina. And so he

05:49sent a couple of his well I I will call them henchmen but representatives to

05:56come and sign the final papers and um and and we were taking the airplane from

06:01North Carolina and flying to Miami. We were confirming all the funds were paid,

06:05the deal was closed and then they were taking the airplane to South America and

06:08I was getting on the commercial airplane and flew back to Washington DC and

06:12halfway through Miami I I was sitting there very happy. I mean, I was 23 years

06:17old, sitting on this jet, multi-million dollar jet. I felt like I’m I’m like

06:21James Bond. This is like super cool. And halfway there, the guys, two of the guys

06:26facing me, I mean, closer than you are to me right now. It was a small jet. And

06:30they said, “Steve, listen. We need to talk to you about something pretty

06:33serious.” Like, “Yeah, sure. What’s the problem?” He said, “Well, listen. We

06:36need to talk to you about our fee.” Your fee? What do you mean your fee? You work

06:40for the buyer. What are you talking about? Yeah, well, we want to get a, you

06:43know, kickback, a fee to get this deal done. And I said, “But the deal’s done.

06:46What are you talking about? I mean, uh, yeah. Well, we want to get make some

06:49money.” You know, well, I’m sorry. The transaction is done. I mean, I don’t

06:53know how much you talking about. They told me how much you wanted. And I said,

06:56“You’re nuts. I mean, that’s all my company made on this deal. You can’t

07:00give me that kind of money.” Well, that’s what we want. I said, “Listen, I

07:04might be a little young and naive. This may be my first deal, but isn’t how this

07:08is supposed to work? Is like you’re supposed to tell me how much you want

07:12and like long time ago.” And then we put this on top of the price and we sell the

07:17plane and you know is that how this is supposed to happen. Listen, we don’t

07:20care. We want this money. I said, “Well, listen, forget it.” Well, listen. When

07:24we get down to the country we’re going to, he said, “You know, we’ll get it all

07:28settled out.” And I said, “You you got it all wrong, boys.” I said, “I’m

07:30getting out in Miami. I’m not going with you home.” He said, “No, no, no. You got

07:35it all wrong.” And he ripped really puts his hand to his inside of his jacket

07:39pocket and he pulled out a pistol and put it right in my face. He said, “No,

07:43you don’t understand.” He said, “You’re coming with us to South America, and

07:48when we get our money, you can go home, and if we don’t ever get our money, you

07:52won’t ever be going home.” Now, let me just explain. This is about the same

07:56time that the movie Scarface came out, okay? And and and if you remember that

08:01movie, okay,

08:03>> all my image in my head was, I’m just going to get chopped up into a bunch of

08:06pieces and they’re just going to send a box to my mother and say, you know, have

08:10fun. And I thought I was done. So I was I went from like you know feeling like I

08:15was James Bond me a hero like and all of a sudden I’m like holy this guy’s gun in

08:19my face. I mean I’m dead. I’m I’m really finished.

08:22>> So we landed in Miami and they have these places called fixed base operators

08:26which are the sort of private terminals for corporate jets.

08:30>> Y

08:30>> so we have to land there and so we were going in. He says come on let’s go call

08:34your boss and get this money sent. So literally he has a gun in his pocket and

08:38he let’s go inside. This is really it’s something out of the movies. It was

08:42really bizarre, very surreal. And you know, in those days, we didn’t have cell

08:46phones. We didn’t have fight phones. So, we had to go inside. We literally put 10

08:50cents into the telephone to call my office. And uh as I’m trying to call

08:55through my office, the lady behind the counter said to the guy who was with me,

08:59“Excuse me, sir. I need your credit card for the fuel to be put on the plane.”

09:03So, the guy turned around and went to go give her the credit card. Well, as soon

09:06as he got as far as the counter, I dropped the phone. I ran out the other

09:10side of the door. So, one side of these terminal goes to the ramp. One goes to

09:14the parking lot where they have taxis and things like that. And uh so I ran

09:19out. There’s a taxi. I said, “Quick, quick, quick, get me to the other side.

09:22I got to get my flight. Go, go, go, go.” And the taxi guy took off, man. I’m in

09:26the back seat, you know, ducking down. The guy comes running out. I mean, this

09:30is really a movie. And I thought he was going to be like starting the shoot, but

09:34it didn’t didn’t get that far. And uh and so anyway, he takes me around to the

09:38airport. This is Miami International Airport. They have these gigantic

09:42concrete columns at the airport and I’m like, you know, literally hiding behind

09:45the columns and thinking these guys coming after me. You know, I’m getting

09:49on my flight. There’s no metal detectors in those days. You know, this is a long

09:52time ago.

09:53>> So, I get my, you know, gate. I’m hiding behind the, you know, the columns. I’m

09:57looking looking. They finally board the airplane. I get on the plane. I’m wait

10:01till they close the door, man. You know, God, man. I mean, I escaped. I escaped,

10:07you know. I flew back home because I called when I was waiting. I called the

10:11officer said, “Hey, did you get the money? Is it all done?” “Yeah, yeah,

10:13it’s all closed.” “Congratulations.” Great. Hang up. Like, “Congratulations.”

10:17I mean, man like this is crazy. Yeah. I mean, I was like, “This is [ __ ]

10:21crazy. This is what this business is about.”

10:23>> So, you’re like, “This is the industry for me then.”

10:25>> Yeah. So, you know, of course, I get home and I’m like shaking on the plane.

10:30I But now, next day, I get back to my office. First thing, of course, I come

10:33out of my apartment. And I’m, you know, looking around. I get in my car. I’m

10:39turning the key like, you know, I guess today,

10:43>> you know, they’re going to blow up or not. And I get to the office and of

10:46course they’re like, “What happened?” I’m like, “Ah,” I told these guys to go

10:49off like, but like for a month, I was looking out

10:53over my shoulder, these guys coming after me. It was It was really bizarre.

10:57But I was like, “Fuck, it can’t be like this normally. I got to do one more

11:01deal. you don’t poop because this is what this Yeah. You know, and then and

11:05then it took me two more months. I I sold another plane then and it was

11:09pretty boring and come by then. But uh and

11:12>> that’s what happened. That was like a billion years ago.

11:15>> What a way to start. What a way to start.

11:17>> That was uh definitely, you know, when they say, “What was your first

11:20airplane?” Say, I’m like, “Wow, that’s it. It is really a crazy story.” Got it.

11:24Okay. Um so, walk us through a little bit about like a typical process. Let’s

11:29say you’ve got um somebody coming and they’re looking to buy a jet from you.

11:33What’s a typical like sales process that you would go through with them?

11:37>> So, the first thing if they’re looking to buy the question is is what kind of

11:42airplane do you really need or what model airplane you need? Cuz there

11:45there’s 150 different aircraft models that still trade in the world today. So

11:52there’s been about 260 models that have been built since 1963 when the first

11:56corporate jets were made, but a lot of them obviously went to the graveyard and

11:59there’s still about 150 that are still trading from a small little citation to

12:04a Boeing. And so the idea is how do we figure out which airplane model you

12:11need? And so that’s where we take them through a process through our app or ask

12:16them a number of questions on the phone and things to try to filter out the

12:20airplanes that that don’t meet their needs. Yeah.

12:23>> Because that’s the key first of all to figure out what is what they need at

12:27least at a minimum. And then you tell them anything above this you can have

12:31but this is sort of the baseline. Don’t go below because it won’t meet your

12:35objectives whether it’s financial, whether it’s operating costs or or

12:39whether it’s the operating specifics of uh the performance or things like that.

12:43So the number one thing is really figure out what they need. Okay. And then they

12:48then what they want might be something different.

12:52>> Gotcha. Gotcha. Okay. Um, and you obviously like you’re famous for like

12:57showing the wall basically and then walking through people in your app and

13:00you’re asking them a series of questions. Maybe for the audience like

13:03tell them a little bit about about those questions and like why you have the them

13:06ordered in that particular way.

13:08>> Well, number one is how much do you want to spend? And you know I would say half

13:12the time the answer is I don’t have a budget.

13:16>> Okay.

13:16>> And and my answer is you’re full of [ __ ]

13:19>> Okay. You know, it’s it’s the normal answer you get because everybody wants

13:23to feel like I you know, just tell me what’s available. Tell me what’s

13:28available. It’s like, I want to buy a car. Okay. Okay, fine. Well, you know,

13:32what’s for sale? What do you need? A twoseater? Do you want a convertible? Do

13:36you want a station wagon? You want a camper? You want, you know, you can’t

13:39say, I want to buy a car. You know, you have to sort of give me a little bit of

13:43parameters to narrow it down. It’s the same thing with an airplane. So, the key

13:47is how much you want to spend. And then after that is how many people do you got

13:50to carry? That tells you how big of an airplane you need to get. How old of an

13:54airplane? Because that could tell you, you know, financially how much can you

13:57want to spend. You said how many people want to carry now? How old of an

14:00airplane? And then the last question is is how far do you have to go for? I use

14:06a term saying about five or six times a year. What’s the longest trip you need

14:11to go on? And because if you’re, let’s say, going from London to the south of

14:16France every few weeks and you’re going to China once a year, you don’t buy an

14:20airplane to go to China. So what we’re saying is get an airplane that meets

14:24your needs, you know, 80% of the time, not 100% of the time. And and then we

14:30start going backwards from there. Okay, now we got these four questions

14:33answered. That filters out literally 95% of the airplanes. And now we really

14:38laser focus into those and start looking at the difference between those. And

14:42that’s where the sort of buyer really gets his attention because now

14:49you see it’s very bespoke, very custom. He has to pay attention now because now

14:54I’m going to ask you really more specific questions and now you have to

14:58really tell me the truth of um you know it’s like a doctor. Yeah.

15:02>> Right. You you got to really tell me what’s matter with you or I can’t help

15:06you. You know,

15:07>> I don’t drink. That’s why

15:10>> once a week from Monday through Friday.

15:12>> Yeah.

15:12>> And and and what about I guess like the the typical steps somebody would go

15:17through, right? So they come in now, you filter down those aircraft and like

15:20let’s say they’ve picked that one like what steps do they normally go through?

15:24>> Okay. So to get to that point,

15:26>> yeah,

15:26>> could take a day, a week, a month, two years.

15:29>> Okay.

15:30>> Okay. That that is it depends. How ready are you really to buy a plane? Okay. But

15:37once you get to that point, okay, and you say, I want to buy that model

15:41aircraft. Yeah.

15:42>> Now we start saying, okay, fine. We know this is what you want. Now we say this

15:46is the inventory of every airplane in the world that is this model. Now there

15:53might be some let’s say for example, let’s say like a GIM G550. Yeah.

15:58>> They went from 2004 to 2021. So the val the price on those airplanes go anywhere

16:04from 14 million to 36 million. So now the question goes back to okay what was

16:09your budget?

16:10>> Yeah.

16:10>> Right. So if you told me your budget was 20 million. Well okay now we can still

16:13look at that airplane but now we’re only looking up to 2010.

16:17All right. So now we go and say okay everything from 2004 to 2010 here is

16:22every single airplane in the world for sale. Now we start doing this sort of

16:25filtering out of you know how do you want the layout? You know what what the

16:29pedigree of the airplane is? you know, where it’s been maintained, um, how many

16:33hours it’s got damage histories and start filtering out what’s available and

16:38and what are the best ones available. And then once the purchase agreement is

16:41executed, the airplane goes into a pre-purchase inspection. So that goes to

16:46a certified maintenance facility that rips the airplane completely apart, goes

16:51through every record in log book from the date of birth until today, and make

16:57sure every single record is perfectly accurate. How long does that take?

17:01>> Well, usually sometime depending on how old the airplane is that the log book

17:04review takes longer than the actual inspection of the airplane because if

17:07you have 10 years or 20 years of records, you really have to go through

17:12because if you don’t have a complete set of records, the value is a problem

17:17because you don’t know whatever happened in that interim period to the airplane

17:21and that’s very important.

17:23>> So, if you don’t have a complete set of records, you got a bit of an issue. So,

17:27usually the inspection takes about two to three weeks. But if they find things

17:32that are wrong with it, especially, you know, the C word, which is corrosion,

17:37that that is something that usually is uh the one that really starts costing a

17:41lot of money and takes a lot longer to get repaired. And so, you can go from 3

17:46weeks to 3 months depending on what you find wrong with the airplane. But

17:50usually the buyer pays for the inspection which could be anywhere

17:54between $50 and $150,000 depending on the level of inspection and the airplane

17:58and the seller is required to fix anything at his cost to uh everything

18:03they find wrong with the airplane.

18:05>> It’s kind of crazy how you’re saying the the barrier to entry is so low but the

18:09knowledge requirement is so high to actually do a good job.

18:11>> Yeah. Well, that’s so that’s where people don’t understand. Our added value

18:18is so hard to explain to people until you actually start executing their

18:24transaction.

18:25>> Because what happens is some of these guys who just get in the industry and

18:28they don’t know what they’re doing,

18:30>> they’ll just sort of step away and let the lawyers to try to figure it out and,

18:34you know, they just sort of wait for their commission check. We are

18:37completely different. And I mean, we really act as if it’s our money on the

18:41table. We’re we’re involved every single day with the maintenance facility, with

18:46the lawyers, with the accountants, with the tax people. We’re much more in the

18:50trenches, you know, representing our client. This is interesting because it

18:53kind of reminds me of like even having like M&A bankers that are representing

18:56you in a deal, for example, when you’re selling a company. It’s like the good

19:00ones will be following along trying to like remove things that are causing

19:03friction in the process to make sure it gets over the line. And you see the ones

19:07that aren’t so good, they just kind of take a backseat and say, “My work’s kind

19:09of done.” Right.

19:10>> Exactly. And and that and there’s a big difference because you really there’s a

19:13lot of money you left on the table.

19:15>> Yeah.

19:16>> So, you know, if you really if you don’t have and that’s where, you know, people

19:20negotiate your fee all the time, right? No matter how much you want to charge,

19:23there’s too much.

19:25>> And uh and and I always tell the client, I mean, don’t look in my pocket. Look in

19:29your pocket. I mean, yeah, look at how much more I’m going to save you when

19:32we’re buying an airplane and how much more I’m going to make you when we’re

19:35selling your airplane cuz we we bring more value there and I’m going to save

19:40you or make you a lot more than my fee. And that’s what you should really be

19:43paying attention to, not, you know, how much money am I making because the value

19:48we add is just just very intangible. So, I’m curious as well, do you find when

19:54you’re when you’re selling a jet, who they bring to go and see the jet

19:59influences a lot whether they’re viewing it from an emotional or like a rational

20:03perspective.

20:04>> So, it’s amazing that u some people decide on which airplane they want to

20:09buy by the color of the seats.

20:12>> It’s weird. It’s really bizarre. And it is so not how to buy a jet 101, but you

20:20know some people do they do do a beautiful job on putting a new interior

20:24in the airplane, make it look beautiful and mechanically the airplane’s a pig.

20:27>> Yeah.

20:27>> Uh so we try to do the other way around. We try to tell them everything about the

20:32airplane and try not to show the picture until the very end. Ah,

20:37>> so that we sort of get rid of the airplanes that don’t make sense, you

20:41know, and and then start showing the interior because you can change the

20:45interior of an airplane. You can’t change the history. You can’t change the

20:50pedigree. You can’t change the maintenance uh facilities that have

20:53worked on the airplane, where it’s been kept, and hanged, not, how many hours

20:56are on it. Those things you can’t change. But to change the seats and the

21:00carpet and the wood, that stuff you can change. And and by the way, you know,

21:05when you’re buying something that much money, you should change it to not pick

21:10one airplane over the other one because you like it better than the other, but

21:14doesn’t mean you would

21:15>> love that airplane. So, you’d want to redo the interior the way you personally

21:19like it.

21:20>> Yeah. Sure.

21:20>> And it’s a minimal piece of the total acquisition course. Why wouldn’t you do

21:24that? Yeah, that makes sense. It actually reminds me when I went and

21:28bought my car, I immediately eliminated everything that wasn’t black seats. So

21:32like I I would have fall into that trap,

21:35>> but it doesn’t make sense.

21:37>> On a plane, I think even more so. Um,

21:40>> okay. I want to spend some time with you to kind of get like a a sales masterass

21:45from you in particular around like high ticket sales. Obviously, you’re talking

21:49to like some of the most powerful people in the world or companies. Uh, so we’d

21:52like to like learn through that. um could you maybe like walk us through

21:56like a typical sales process? But I guess like first starting off with like

22:00the top of the funnel, like how do you actually bring people towards you?

22:03>> Before I had the showroom concept, okay, uh it was a lot like maybe even in the

22:09property business. So the ideal uh way to do business is to go try to

22:15find an owner of an airplane to get a listing.

22:18>> Yeah. and sign that guy up to give you a listing to exclusively represent that

22:25airplane for sale. And then once you had that airplane, you know, people wanted

22:29that airplane, they would come to you and that would sort of be a slow

22:33process, but and going back when this industry was, you know, 50 years ago,

22:38you know, you had to go get a camera, you got to go take pictures, find one

22:42picture, get printed, and get you send it in the in the post. And it it took

22:47like forever. Now things just happened by the second.

22:50>> Um but so the originally it was trying to find a customer by locking up the

22:55airplane and then having buyers come to you. uh since we had the showroom uh and

23:03since we had co uh the amount of airplane demand has

23:08really really gone up and since we had the showroom we got had a lot more face

23:13to face with clients and they saw what we did and how the education process

23:17really was benefiting the buyer. So we went really from 95% representing

23:24sellers and now we’re probably 60% representing buyers.

23:30>> So our whole business model has changed because now they see how much value we

23:37can add to a buyer’s uh sort of goal and it just makes the whole buying process

23:45easier because it is not like buying a piece of property. It’s not like buying

23:49a car. it is so much more complicated and especially on the international

23:53platform it’s really really comp complicated. So it’s it’s really um you

23:59know a process that starts from finding the buyer or seller depending on which

24:03one you’re representing and depending what hat you have on and then the

24:06process starts from there.

24:08>> Wow. So how how much would you say that like cold calling is still important in

24:13your business today? Is that still a practice that you you preach? Well, cold

24:18calling as far as researching the the owners of the airplanes is still very

24:23important because we’re my research department is really trying to find

24:28who’s looking to buy or sell before they’re looking to buy or sell. Yeah.

24:32>> So, they can build that relationship uh on an ongoing basis, but catch them

24:37before they actually make that decision to go forward and hopefully get them to

24:41give us the mandate to represent them to buy or sell. So, we’re trying to get

24:45ahead of the game to sort of build that relationship to get us to get that

24:51agreement and and from there it’s okay, can we get the mandate? And if we can’t

24:56get the mandate, can we still find the other side of that deal? What type of

25:00triggers would you say that you’re looking for when you’re cold calling to

25:03see like when somebody might be looking to change and like how far into the

25:06future you looking to kind of get onto their radar? So, it’s it’s gotten more

25:11difficult because there’s a lot it’s funny you say we have a lot of

25:14competition. There’s probably hundreds of people out there that are trying to

25:19buy or sell airplanes because there is actually no barrier to entry in this

25:23industry. There’s no license required. There’s no accreditation. I there is an

25:27accreditation group. It’s called the International Aircraft Deals

25:31Association, IATA, and we’re a part of them. and they’re they probably their

25:36members probably represent about 65% of all the jet transactions,

25:44but there’s a lot of individual people that just basically have a cell phone

25:48and a laptop and they’re trying to get in there and try to do a deal. It’s not

25:51as easy as it sounds, but the barrier to entry is is uh pretty low. So the the

25:58the idea is, you know, how do we get in there and get these people who are

26:02getting tons of these inquiries or people baring every every month? How do

26:07they pay attention to us? Our exposure on social media over the last couple

26:12years has helped us

26:14>> get known more. And because we have that exposure, people when they get the call

26:19saying it’s from the jet business, they’ll say, “Oh, you guys are the guys

26:23with the videos, blah, blah, blah.” and and it allows us that extra effort, you

26:27know, or e easiness of getting into the door and starting a conversation with

26:32them. So, that’s really the hardest part is getting them to talk to you on the

26:36phone because they get bombarded with these guys every month and they’ll just

26:40hang up on you.

26:41>> So, that that’s helped a lot. Uh, but the fact of the matter is is we’re a

26:45very boutique kind of we only deal in a certain size of airplane and you know

26:51and the upper end of the market. So we’re really focused, super laser

26:54focused on on the upper end of the market.

26:57>> And what type of price range would that be?

26:59>> So it’s not necessarily price range because the the way the airplanes are

27:02are divided up into categories called they’re called small, midsize, super

27:08midsize, large cabin, uh ultra long range, and VIP airliner like this

27:14airplane. So we don’t do the small and midsize airplanes. We deal with the

27:18super mids and up. And out of the 25,000 jets in the world, that’s probably eight

27:24of the 25,000 because the majority of the small and midsize jets, that’s

27:29really, you know, 60% of the airplanes out there. And it’s funny because you

27:34look at this big airplane we have here. This is this is nothing. This is this is

27:39not the market, you know, and and this is maybe the perception what the market

27:44is, but the real the real corporate jet is sitting inside of a vano or, you

27:50know, some a minivan the way you can’t even stand up.

27:53>> In your own sales process, like maybe give us some insight here. It’s what are

27:57some steps that you would say a pro would do selling a a plane um that

28:02others wouldn’t do that you can help increase the probability that you you

28:05close a deal? So, like in the way how you just said show explaining to people,

28:10okay, this is I’m going to explain the aircraft to you first before I show you

28:13any pictures. That’s obviously that’s a pro move.

28:16>> So, if we’re representing a buyer or representing a seller because there’s

28:20two different approaches, right? Because it depends on what hat I have on, who am

28:24I representing? What whose best interest am I representing? Because you have a

28:28completely different answer based on that.

28:30>> Okay? Okay. But if I’m representing the buyer, okay, uh first of all, I know

28:36everything on the market. So, I know what this airplane should be worth and

28:43what the real value is. Okay? Even if I’m selling an airplane, I know what the

28:48market is and I know what that airplane should sell for. So when somebody comes

28:52to me and say, “Well, I could buy this airplane. You know, I have this other

28:56airplane I could pay for this price.” And I could say, you know, you’re full

28:59of [ __ ] You know, by the way, you know, that airplane crashed, you know, or it

29:02has damage history or so if if we’re sending a buyer, you know, we really

29:06know the the questions to ask the seller that we’re not going to have problems

29:12with later and surprises later because that’s the problem. You get in so deep

29:17and and the seller doesn’t tell you all the issues. They they’re relying on you

29:21go find it yourself.

29:23>> Okay. But now if you’re representing a seller,

29:26>> same thing. You’re not going to throw up everything all the bad things about

29:30every on the airplane. You’re you’re you know, you want to get sort of the hook

29:34in the fish. Pull them in. Pull him in. Pull him in. Of course, never

29:37misrepresent anything, but you know, you just don’t you know, just throw all the

29:42negatives because then you’ll chase the guy away. So you have to it’s a delicate

29:45line you you you sort of are walking to sort of sort of feed them information as

29:50you go and and that’s really the the point. How do you keep them pulled in

29:55deeper and deeper and deeper

29:56>> when you’re going to like expanding your sales team? Like what type of

29:59characteristics are you looking for? And do you like hiring people with prior

30:02experience or like fresh? I like hiring people that have aviation in their blood

30:08that they really um I don’t care if you’ve been selling the most highest

30:12price ticket items in the world. If you don’t love, sleep, eat, drink airplanes,

30:19you’re just going to hate it here because first of all, it looks like a

30:22glamorous industry.

30:23>> Yeah.

30:23>> And you know, it it is in a way, but the fact of the matter is is we have a

30:28different model here. And a lot of my competitors, nobody has a showroom,

30:32nobody has an office. They work out of their house. They go to the airport.

30:35They go to fly someplace and try to meet a client here or there in a restaurant

30:39or at their office or going cruising around the airport trying to find

30:42pilots. I don’t know. It’s just

30:44>> um here we’re in the office 90% of the time and we’re making phone calls and

30:50and we have the luxury that a lot of people come here to the showroom. So, we

30:53get to meet a lot of people, but not all our clients come here by any stretch of

30:57the imagination. So, it’s it’s a different kind of a situation than most

31:01of my competitors have.

31:02>> If you’re enjoying this conversation, please do subscribe. We’re a brand new

31:06show, so this will really help us to grow and reach more people. And in

31:10return, we promise to make this show a little better with every single episode.

31:14Sound fair? Let’s get back to it. Jet buying for a high netw worth audience.

31:19Um, that audience is really going to be thinking about this. Maybe it’s a

31:22daydream, maybe it’s something really concrete.

31:25You’ve talked about the process of we’ve talked a little bit about the process of

31:31buying a jet, but if we go back to if we think of it like a video game, there’s

31:36levels, right? So, you start off with business class, you charter, you uh get

31:41a jet card, you go fractional, there’s probably levels within fractional, and

31:44then you go full full ownership. What are the upgrade points where it makes

31:49sense to move and level up? So I usually tell people if you’re flying 150 to 200

31:55hours a year it you should be going from charter fractional to owning an

32:00airplane. It’s not because it’s financially cheaper. It’s just

32:05logistically easier because if you’re flying let’s say 200 hours a year you

32:10know the average flight is about two and a half hours.

32:14Okay. So if you’re talking about, you know, 75 flights a year, that’s, you

32:18know, really one and a half times a week, you’re, you know, you have to

32:21call, you have to find an airplane, becomes a pain in the neck. So just

32:26logistically, it makes more sense to have an airplane. Um, financially, it

32:31depends on what kind of airplane you’re flying and and really what your trips

32:34are. If you’re going, you know, within an hour trip or you’re going on 10-hour

32:37trips, but uh it does definitely does make sense to analyze what your root

32:43structure is. how many people you carrying if you go like last minute or

32:47if you know weeks in advance. So there’s a lot of things that that sort of get

32:51considered in there. But you know today owning a jet is getting more expensive

32:57and the problem is getting parts when the airplane breaks and you know so now

33:03sometimes you say well maybe I should have an airplane and a fractional so I

33:08have a standby you know but that’s you know you have to be flying you know more

33:13than 200 whatever but uh so sometimes or maybe you say you know what I have a jet

33:18for you know 80% of my flights

33:21>> but you know What? I need a different model airplane for these 20% and I buy a

33:26fraction or I charter.

33:28>> Got it.

33:28>> Okay. So, there could be a hybrid.

33:30>> That could make sense also. And and the fact of owning versus fractional versus

33:38charter. It’s sort of when do you have a beard? It it really it’s different for

33:43different people.

33:44>> That makes sense. So if we you’ve talked before where a lot of uh a lot of buyers

33:49are companies um so the corporate and corporate jet you’re a CEO you’re making

33:55the business case to the board hey we really need a jet is there a template or

33:59a playbook for that business case

34:01>> well I can tell you I’ve done an analysis that if you’re flying about 200

34:06hours a year and just to give you an idea um

34:11400 hours is about 175 5,000 miles. Okay. So, when you really think

34:20about in airline terms, you know, platinum level

34:24>> is usually 100,000 mi person, right? That’s less than 200 hours of flying.

34:32>> Okay.

34:32>> Okay. If you’re flying 200 hours a year, I can pretty much show you how I can get

34:38you 30 more days in the office a year.

34:43>> Wow. Okay. Now, that has nothing to do with

34:47your productivity on the plane. Okay? Because you work when you’re on

34:52your corporate jet. You don’t really work when you’re on a commercial plane.

34:55You got people, you know, talking to you, kids screaming, crying, you know,

35:00you you know, it’s and you can’t bring other people. If you have a corporate

35:02jet, sometimes you say, “Take three or four people from your office. Let’s go.”

35:06You know, you’re doing a lot of business and working on the plane. Take that all

35:09aside and you can really save about 30 extra days a year just with 200 hours of

35:15flying. And that is talks about not having to go to the airport 2 hours in

35:20advance. Yeah.

35:21>> Having to, you know, wait for your luggage at the end and then having to go

35:23through immigration, you know, how you just get on your plane and go. So all of

35:27those kind of savings going to an airport that’s closer, leaving at the

35:30middle of the night when you’re finished with a meeting, not having to wait for

35:33the next day to get on a plane,

35:35>> all that kind of stuff. So what’s an extra month out of your executive to be

35:40literally you know in the office? It’s a big number of money business and you

35:46know

35:46>> that’s a good business

35:47>> and the connectivity when you’re on the plane and the security and the

35:51flexibility and it it just there’s a lot of intangible stuff that are

35:56>> more than the financial. So in terms of the team I need or the structure I need

36:01to buy a plane or buy a jet um can you walk through like what lawyers you need

36:07tax structure like where what jurisdiction should I be looking at?

36:11>> Uh if it’s domestic then tax wise you know it’s not as difficult but but you

36:17really need to look at the tax benefits. Yeah. And in the US, you have the

36:21depreciation benefit, which you get 100% of the depreciation of the value of the

36:26airplane the year you buy the airplane,

36:28>> which is an amazing added value because it reduces the cost of the airplane

36:33drastically and you’d rather pay reduce your price of your airplane than the

36:37money you were just going to give to the government anyway. Uh but there’s other

36:41benefits and you can own the airplane in a special purpose vehicle and then rent

36:46it from that company. So it it becomes a corporate expense.

36:50>> Ah okay.

36:52>> You know versus you know just a tax benefit. You also get the operating cost

36:57benefit and you also rent it out to third parties

37:01>> which also changes your tax. It increases your your benefits and you’re

37:06getting income which reduces your operating cost. Uh so that’s from a tax

37:10standpoint. There’s obviously you need a aviation transactional specialist lawyer

37:16to help you negotiate the purchase agreement because it gets very

37:20complicated and the biggest mistake buyers make is to have their in-house

37:25counsel or their family office lawyer

37:28>> say go negotiate this

37:30>> big big big mistake. Um you really need to get the specialist in the industry

37:35who knows what they’re talking about. Could could you give an example of where

37:39where they typically like miss certain things, right? Because this reminds me a

37:42lot again going back to that M&A example. I’ve seen people just go get

37:46like a normal lawyer that they know and bring them to the transaction. It’s like

37:50a disaster waiting to happen. But so could you expand on that?

37:52>> Yeah, sure. I mean, you know, you start talking to them about, well, you need to

37:56get an export certificate of air worthiness and a dregistration from the

37:59country where it’s coming from and going to, and they’re like, what?

38:02>> Yeah.

38:03>> You know, what are you talking about? AK. Well, this is it’s not it’s like

38:06getting me a cup of coffee to an aviation lawyer. I mean, it’s it’s

38:09nothing.

38:09>> That’s what I mean, you know, or you know, liability.

38:15Okay. Um, you know, when does ownership when does liability transfer over

38:20insurance coverage, you know, if the airplane’s in the in the maintenance

38:23facility and um and you have a contract with it with the buyer and the seller

38:29and all of a sudden, I don’t know, let’s say um a truck bumps into the wing.

38:33Yeah. while it’s in the facility. Oh, whose liability is it? Whose insurance

38:37got to cover it? Do you have to even continue to buy the airplane because now

38:41it has damage history? Do you want to buy the airplane? You know, that that

38:45kind of stuff the the a typical lawyer wouldn’t wouldn’t know. So, out of and

38:49if you go to negotiate with the manufacturer, if you’re looking at

38:52buying a new airplane, you would think what’s so difficult. They send you a

38:56contract. I negotiated the guy a half a million bucks. Well done, you know,

39:00in-house lawyer. But you know that’s so stupid because we negotiated a contract

39:06with them to buy a new airplane. We made a couple of changes on the contract.

39:12>> Now the next time we go back to them, we start with that contract that has a

39:17couple of changes and we make a couple more changes and the next time we make a

39:21couple more and now we have like 30 changes that we already know we can do.

39:27>> This guy comes in, you know, and he says, “Oh, okay. this comes in this nice

39:31printed form. This is the contract we use. Well, okay, we want to negotiate

39:35this price down. He thinks just because they saved a few hundred grand that he’s

39:38a hero. But he doesn’t have any clue of what he could have done. And and these

39:44are the sort of little things um like um you know cancellation penalties, um

39:51options you might be able to get thrown into a deal, warranty issues, there

39:55those kind of things. And that that kind of stuff is, you know, the the the

39:59manufacturers, they want to show that they sold the airplane for this price.

40:06>> And if you can show that because they can tell all the other buyers, I’m

40:09sorry, this is the price we sell for,

40:11>> then maybe you can get away with getting some other things done and flown into

40:15the deal. As long as the headline says, we sold the airplane for this price.

40:20>> There’s the floor.

40:20>> Yeah. That’s like when you rent an office building, you know, office

40:24spaces, you know, sometimes the landlord gives you free rent. Well, you know, at

40:28the beginning, well, why would they give you free rent? They say, listen, we’re

40:31keeping the rent at this much per square foot, but we’ll give you, you know, if

40:36you can sign 10ear lease, we’ll give you a year free rent. Well, in your head,

40:39I’m getting, you know, 10% off.

40:42>> Yeah.

40:43>> Of the value, but they’re saying, listen, our rent is this much. You know,

40:47we give you a year free rent, but the rent is this much.

40:49>> Yeah. So when they value the building, they’re rent they’re valuing the

40:53building based on this rent per square foot. So you the perception is different

40:58than the reality.

40:59>> Are there any other like big mistakes that you think people should avoid?

41:03>> I mean really delving into the the history of the airplane is super super

41:09important. You know, who has been doing the maintenance, where the airplane’s

41:14been based, has it been hangared? Um, and do they have a full-time maintenance

41:19director? Uh those kind of questions are really important because you know an

41:24airplane like I said before could have a beautiful new paint a beautiful interior

41:29like I love this plane and it could be really a problem and you go through the

41:33books and the records and find out it had it’s been in the shop eight times in

41:37the last 10 months and you know okay why you know and so

41:42these are the kind of things where you know a guy who’s a regular lawyer would

41:46never know that the airplane goes in the shop they say everything’s working

41:50today. But yeah, but it’s been broken eight times in 10 months. There’s

41:53something out with this airplane.

41:55>> And they wouldn’t think to to know that history. They would just look at the the

41:59sort of the if you want to call it the balance sheet view, what it looks like

42:03today.

42:04>> They don’t look at, you know, the day-to-day cash flow or, you know, P&L

42:08kind of thing. They, you know, that that’s the the difference. It it seems

42:11kind of crazy given like the price of it, the importance of like safety and

42:15all of those other variables that you would want to like cut corners on a

42:18purchase like this. Well, you are a thousand% right. But when an airplane is

42:23used on a charter uh solely for charter, the the idea is

42:30how much can I keep that airplane in the air flying and maybe use a band-aid here

42:35and there to, you know, if something really gets wrong, fix it, but keep

42:40going. versus the CEO who says to the fight department, “I don’t give a [ __ ]

42:47if if you know, you hear a slightest little, you know, creek someplace,

42:53replace it.” Yeah.

42:55>> Okay. You know, I you know, if there’s a scratch on the leather, replace it. You

42:59know, those kind of things where, you know, you and you have a full-time

43:02maintenance director,

43:04>> their job is to be proactive and make sure that 10 to 11 care is given to that

43:09airplane. And basically they act as if it’s their airplane. And the owner is a

43:14guest on the plane. That’s the true kind of crew you need to make them feel like

43:20it’s their airplane and they are and hey, by the way, it’s their life on the

43:25airplane as well, okay? They’re they’re not going to be any daredevil and try to

43:28cut corners. But when you get these guys who are needing to build time and they

43:34they don’t have a lot of experience and they they just want a job to build the

43:37hours on the jets, they’ll do crazy things. So, you really got to look at

43:41the experience of the crew, too. The the the maintenance director is a a really

43:45interesting kind of segue of, you know, we’ve gone through the process, bought

43:50the jet, now I need pilots, I need somebody to put the champagne in the

43:55fridge, I need tires, a hanger. like what’s the how do you go about finding

44:01the team to run the play?

44:04>> So that depends on where the airplane is based. And why I say that is because if

44:08you’re in the United States probably

44:1375 80% of the flights that those airplanes are taking are domestic. And

44:18you just pull up with your car right up to the side of the airplane, get on the

44:21plane, the guy in the ramp takes your car, you get in the plane, you take off

44:24and you go. Everything’s so easy. But outside the US, especially here in the

44:29UK, every single flight you take is an international flight. Okay? So, you

44:35know, you have different currencies, different languages, different, you

44:37know, Euro control. You have different federal regulations. You It is super

44:42complicated. You need you need landing uh permission slots, you need airway

44:47permission slots. Uh it’s so complicated. So in saying that about 80%

44:53of the jets in America are run with an in-house flight department

44:59>> and outside the United States about 90% of the jets are managed by management

45:05companies and those m because it gets complicated if you’re flying to China

45:10and Africa and Russia and stuff you know it is really hard getting permits and

45:16language problems and overflight and currency exchanges and credit and things

45:21like that and your own little fight department, it’s too much to to handle.

45:25So, you want to get a management company. So, the management company does

45:29all of that.

45:31>> Got it.

45:31>> Okay. You pay them a monthly fee and depending on what kind of airplane it is

45:36in which the company is could cost between 10 and $20,000

45:41a month. Mhm.

45:42>> However, since they’re managing a fleet of

45:46airplanes, their buying ability can reduce the cost of insurance of pilot

45:54training and fuel purchases. And usually the savings that they make in those

45:59three line items

46:02>> can can basically offset the cost of their management fee. Got it.

46:06>> So they take that whole headache. Now the pilots are selected by you. Of

46:11course, you’re paying them through the management company. Uh they sort of work

46:15for you, but they really, you know, on the payroll of the management company

46:18and they hire the flight attendant and the pilots and they pay the fuel and the

46:21maintenance and the landing. They do everything. And at the end of one month,

46:25you get a bill with all the receipts and an invoice for saying this is how much

46:29we spent this month and you pay that. when you’re have your own in-house

46:33flight department, you have to get your chief pilot, your second pilot, your

46:38flight attendant, and they are doing all that kind of stuff. And you have like

46:41one bookkeeper on your staff that basically is processing all the

46:45invoices. So, depends on where you are is a different answer, but it it is

46:52usually one person who runs the flight department if it’s your own flight

46:55department. And it’s it’s something easy to do, but when you start doing the

47:00international side of it, it gets much more complicated.

47:03>> And you talked earlier on you talked about chartering. And I think in a

47:06previous interview, you’ve talked about roughly 30% of a jet’s time is maybe out

47:10on charter.

47:12>> Obviously, there’s lots of different ways to charter. What’s the best way to

47:15set up chartering and what should you look for? So yes, about 30 40% of the of

47:22jets that are in the fleet are are chartered and and some of them are 100%

47:28just in the charter fleet and some of them are just owned and people don’t fly

47:33them enough. So they just put them out to charter part-time to reduce their

47:39cost of their own flying or just to keep the airplane flying or the crew busy

47:43because they’re just not flying it enough. And uh there’s the way that it

47:48works. So if if it’s the latter where it’s a company that owns it and they’re

47:53just trying to get some contribution to their operating costs or keeping it

47:56busy, the an aircraft budget is basically has fixed cost and it has

48:01direct operating cost or variable cost. So the fixed costs are whether you fly

48:06one hour or 400 hours a year, you got to pay this amount. This is your pilot

48:10salary, your insurance, your hanger. Whether you fly or you don’t fly, it’s

48:14fixed. And on a on the jets, it’s going to run you anywhere between $700,000 to

48:20$1.3 million depending on a small jet or a long range jet. And that’s fixed cost.

48:25And then every hour you fly is the variable cost. And that’s your fuel,

48:29your landing fees, your catering, the the hotel for the pilots, the

48:33maintenance costs, engine reserves. You don’t pay that unless you fly the plane.

48:38And that runs anywhere between $2,500 an hour to $6,000 an hour. So the way the

48:45budget works is fixed cost variable cost and depending on how many hours you fly

48:52that’s you know increase the variable cost.

48:55>> So the way charter contribution works is let’s say that that the smallest jet

49:01let’s say or the biggest jet you want to say let’s say the biggest jet is $6,000

49:05an hour for your variable cost but that airplane would rent for $10,000 an hour.

49:11So now if you fly that air, if you rent the airplane out $200 a year, you’re

49:16making $4,000 an hour because you’re renting it for 10 and it cost you six.

49:21You’re getting $4,000 an hour times 200 hours, you’re making $800,000

49:26profit.

49:27>> But on that airplane, you’re at a million2 or million3 fixed cost.

49:31>> So basically it brings that million2 down to $400,000. So now your fixed cost

49:36of 400 and it cost you 6,000 an hour to fly it. So you you when people start

49:42saying, “Well, I want to charter the airplane so I can fly for free.” The

49:46reason that doesn’t work is because you have to fly the airplane on charter so

49:52many hours

49:53>> to get the fixed cost down below zero that the airplane’s not available for

49:59you to fly yourself.

50:01>> Does the Does the variable cost include um wear and tear? Because obviously like

50:06there’s engine hours and so is is that included in the variable cost or is it

50:12actually I’m flying it more so I’m going to have more maintenance in a year’s

50:16time or 6 months time.

50:18>> Great question. So on our app when we bring people in and we show them that

50:22that fixed cost number we also say listen this is cash flow. M

50:28>> however you should acrue this amount per year and this direct operating cost per

50:34hour is cash flow but you should acrue this much per year and and exactly what

50:41you’re saying is because after five six seven years you want to do a new

50:45interior. You want to paint the airplane. You want to upgrade some kind

50:48of cockpit kind of thing and it might cost you a million dollars. So, it’s not

50:54an annual cost, but you should acrue it because after every 5, seven years, you

50:58do have to do some upgrades. On the direct operating costs, we add that

51:02number in because usually airplanes between six and 10 years have a major

51:08inspection and they can cost between$1 and $2 million.

51:11>> So, again, we say acrew for this, but it’s not cash flow out of pocket for

51:17your budget.

51:18>> Hey, quick one. Steve is literally giving us a master class in jet purchase

51:22and ownership right now. It’s everything featured in this episode and more. When

51:26does ownership actually make sense, how to structure the purchase, what nobody

51:31tells you about the true cost of owning one, and the questions you should be

51:34asking any broker before you sign anything. If you’re at the stage in your

51:37life where this is even a conversation you’re having, this is the thing to read

51:41before you do anything else. It’s completely free to download. Simply scan

51:45the QR code or click the link in the description right now. Okay, back to

51:49Steve. So, you’ve obviously been in this industry for for long for long enough to

51:52have seen like multiple different cycles. Uh, so economic crashes, COVID,

51:57uh, and the boom that obviously followed after that. So, we want to get your read

52:01in terms of like where things are kind of heading. Um, cuz obviously you’ve got

52:05like private aviation, you’ve got like the jet cards, fractional ownership,

52:09electrification even on the horizon. What’s your take on like where the

52:13industry is going? Well, right now the industry is incredibly hot and uh if you

52:18really want an airplane today that’s less than 5 years old, you know, good

52:22luck. There’s really no inventory available for sale. And and why I asked

52:27this question to all my my my peers? We can’t figure it out. Maybe it’s because

52:32of people there so many people exited or or you know got into the public markets

52:36or whatever it was in the last year or two and there’s been a lot of money

52:39that’s been made. Yeah.

52:41>> Mostly in tech. uh and now is getting more in the next couple years. You got

52:46you know the synthetic biology, you have robotics, you have AI, you have all it

52:50it’s just it’s coming and uh the the market is just really really tight of

52:55what’s available for sale. So we thought by the end of last year it was going to

53:00dry up because usually the you know the last quarter every year because

53:04depreciation you get a little uptick and then January slows down but it really

53:07continued and we’ve been super busy and the market’s been very very tight. So

53:13everything right now is good but of course you know listen no tree grows to

53:16the sky eventually it’s you know got to stop and and and come down and we

53:20thought maybe you know there’s how many wars going on around the world and

53:24that’s going to stop things you know Russia you know took 300 jets out of the

53:29industry you know and all those transactions not a hiccup uh co for sure

53:34I mean you know in the first two months everybody said the end of the world is

53:37here nobody’s going to buy a jet again ever and you know the world is over. And

53:42then after 2 months they started saying, you know, there might be a little light

53:46at the end of the tunnel and all of a sudden that light hit us like you know

53:50like that and all of a sudden demand went up up and you know all these

53:54airplanes that are depreciating assets started appreciating you know cars and

53:59motorcycles you know you couldn’t buy anything and the prices went crazy high.

54:04Um, so that that that sort of, you know, got in the market that brought a lot of

54:09people into the market that never used to be in the market, but that could

54:13afford to be in the market. So there’s a lot of companies they can afford it, but

54:16they never could justify it in their head. But once they really got forced

54:20into it during co,

54:21>> they sort of said, you know what, wow, this really is, you know, bringing a lot

54:25of value to it. So I I wouldn’t say all of them stayed, but I would say a third

54:30of those people stayed. for that, you know, bring you know there’s a um rising

54:36tide raises, you know, all the boats. So, it it increased the sort of

54:41addressable market of potential people in the industry. So now that sort of

54:46helped the market be stronger because there’s more players in it and a lot of

54:51younger people are really a lot of younger people have come into the market

54:55because they have made a lot of money in the last number of years

54:58>> and there’s also a generational wealth that’s being transferred down now and

55:05that’s getting a lot of money into the younger generation. So you you know

55:09where 30 years ago the average age of a CEO of a company buying an airplane was

55:14probably in his late 60s, today that person is probably in his late 40s. So

55:20that adds so many more people into the market. So all of these things have sort

55:25of made the market uh busier, more people in it, the addressable market and

55:30and uh it’s just made the the market more available for a level below what it

55:36used to be. Where is the market going from here? Listen, there’s these EV

55:41tolls, these flying cars. The the EV toll is an electric vertical takeoff

55:45landing. It’s sort of a a passenger carrying drone. It’s uh that is going to

55:50be huge in and and not the future. We’re talking about in the next year or two,

55:56these things are being certified and coming to the market. And that’s going

55:59to make a lot of the smaller shorter trips, helicopters, smaller jets, turbo

56:04props. It’s going to take a lot of that market out cuz that’s going to be uh a

56:09very inexpensive way to travel short distances. It’s going to be carbon zero.

56:15It’s going to have no engine noise and have drone noise, but no engine noise.

56:19Uh it’s going to be safer because they’re going to have multiple

56:22distributed um uh power sources. So, there’s a lot of benefits to those kind

56:27of things. And as far as uh the corporate jets, the corporate jet use,

56:31they’re trying to make them more efficient as they go. They’re trying to

56:34use uh different kind of fuel sources that are going to be much more uh carbon

56:40friendly and the manufacturers have done so much to make it better and better

56:45from from that kind of standpoint even though there’s such a minuscule effect

56:50on the environment. It’s just stupid to even talk about it. Um so we see the

56:55industry being you know very very strong going forward and where it’s going to go

57:01from you know the corporate jet side it I’m curious to know myself because you

57:07know the airplanes now are able to go 8,000 miles nautical miles so really

57:11anywhere in the world with one stop you can go anywhere and you know you can go

57:15from here to Singapore non-stop you can go from here to Hawaii non-stop uh you

57:20know you don’t even want to be on an airplane while So

57:24>> where does the fleet go now? So the technology is got to be developed from

57:29there. You know, maybe it’s Elon’s trip to the moon. I don’t know. But uh but

57:35you know, it it things can become just more efficient. They’re going to be

57:38more, you know, economically available to to more people. and um and hopefully

57:45the um economics are just uh make it more ripe for a lower level of wealth to

57:54be able to utilize that kind of form of transportation.

57:57>> Um another question obviously like China’s gaining ground inside like

58:01commercial aviation with like comarmac. Um when should we expect to see like the

58:06Chinese jets coming in to like compete? It’s really bizarre because they

58:11nobody’s ever trusted getting into a Chinese

58:16manufactured airplane. And it doesn’t mean to say that there’s nothing wrong

58:20with them, of course. And actually, Airbus used to have a um uh a plant that

58:29assembled Airbuses in China. And so there was they were Airbus airplanes

58:38manufactured in China, but they were basically put together there and no

58:43problem. They were they were all into the Chinese fleet. Comarmac is a you

58:47know is a big company. they’re very credible and when it becomes much more

58:54cost effective than when it competes against the US manufacturers or the

58:59French manufacturer or the Canadian manufacturers or Brazilian um you will

59:03see people move over to it. it. People are very easy to get adapted to

59:10something if the price

59:12>> well you look you look at the Chinese EV cars and particularly in Europe how well

59:16they’re doing and um it makes a lot of sense.

59:19>> Absolutely. And and you’ll start seeing you know just the first company has to

59:24buy that plane and put it into service because human beings are like penguins,

59:29right? The first one jumps in the water they all follow.

59:32>> And who’s the first one that jumps in? That’s the question, you know? And and

59:36the same thing with these EV toll, these flying cars, you know, people, oh, you

59:40know, you’re going to really want to get into one of those things, you know, and

59:42they say, well, you know, I’m not get one without a pilot.

59:45>> In today’s world,

59:47>> it really takes something like um an influencer.

59:51>> Yeah.

59:51>> Okay. Who, you know, might have 500 million followers, whatever, and they

59:57get on one of these things and they get off and say, “Wow, that was [ __ ]

1:00:00amazing. I loved it.”

1:00:02>> Then it’s normal.

1:00:03>> It’s done. Yeah. It’s done. You don’t need government approvals. You don’t

1:00:06need PR campaigns. You don’t need the justification

1:00:09that something simple as that makes everything go away. However, if they get

1:00:15off the plane, it’s like you’re screwed, right? Yeah.

1:00:20You know, in our industry, you don’t ever ask a question you don’t know the

1:00:24answer to.

1:00:24>> Yeah. and and and uh so

1:00:27>> well if you look at driverless car like San Francisco the Whimo taxis and stuff

1:00:31are all doing their thing and so people adapt quickly

1:00:34>> people adapt and and you know everybody hates change

1:00:38>> but the fact of the matter is is humans can adapt very easily they just don’t

1:00:42want to admit it but it it happens

1:00:45>> I mean think about social media today okay can you imagine

1:00:51if I walked up to you on the street fintech

1:00:54Look at this picture of what I had for lunch today. This is amazing. Isn’t this

1:00:59really Look at this food. You like you crazy. What are you showing me what you

1:01:02had to eat today? And I what? Look like but now I I post it on my Instagram and

1:01:08like oh this is what happened like in a restaurant or you know you my

1:01:12grandmother died 20 years ago today. I I really am so heartbroken. You’re like

1:01:17what are you telling me for? But it’s okay to put it on Instagram and you know

1:01:21and everybody says oh I’m so sorry. Things that just were so crazy to think

1:01:27about years ago are normal today.

1:01:29>> Well, think of Uber like getting into a car with a stranger

1:01:32>> completely.

1:01:33>> As a child, you were told don’t get into a car with a stranger, right? That was

1:01:36the whole lesson. It was

1:01:37>> I mean, so, you know, the world is so different. I mean, you know, and I I

1:01:42gave a a graduation speech my university uh last May and and I said, you know,

1:01:48give your parents a break, man. And I mean, you know, the things that we were

1:01:52able to say, forget 10 years ago, 20 years ago, 5 years ago, are just not

1:01:59acceptable today.

1:02:00>> And you know, you you can’t say that. You can’t say that. Hey, you know, [ __ ]

1:02:06I mean, you know, you know, 10 years ago, nobody knew what AI, robotics,

1:02:10synthetic biology, you know, crypto this is all new vocabulary. You know,

1:02:15give your parents a break, man. world changes and it’s changing faster and

1:02:18faster. So, you know, the world adapts, it changes and and people now really

1:02:24things get on uh social media and all of a sudden in 5 minutes all of a sudden

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1:03:43>> Uh, now I want to fire through a handful of quick questions that I’ve been dying

1:03:48to know and I think everyone else wants to know as well.

1:03:50>> Um, first of all, who is your tailor? Cuz they’re doing a fabulous job.

1:03:57>> I love Oswald Bang.

1:03:59>> Okay.

1:03:59>> Uh, which is a shop here in London. Uh, and I This is a Ralph Lauren purple suit

1:04:08and uh, Doce Gabbana. Those are those are the three that I usually use.

1:04:11>> Amazing. Where is your favorite place for a business lunch in London?

1:04:15>> Right here we’re sitting.

1:04:18>> Second.

1:04:19>> I I can tell you in in uh I’d say in 13 years, if I have been out to lunch a 100

1:04:27times in 13 years, I I’d be way way exaggerating. I I maybe it’s been 30 40

1:04:32times and I just never go out as Got it. Usually at lunchtime I go out to go to a

1:04:37gym and work out for an hour, but I usually don’t do those lunches.

1:04:41>> Okay. Where’s your favorite airport?

1:04:43>> Well, Farm Airport is actually my favorite. It’s it’s the most civilized.

1:04:46It’s the cleanest. It’s uh you know, might be an extra few minutes to drive

1:04:50out there, but once you’re on the you know, on the ramp, you get out and go

1:04:53real quick. So, it’s it’s a it’s a beautiful airport. What’s the craziest

1:04:57interior design request in a jet you’ve seen or heard about?

1:05:01>> Well, in the old days, uh, when we did a lot of stuff in the Middle East, they

1:05:06wanted to have the chairs that were always pointing to Mecca.

1:05:10>> Ah,

1:05:11>> that was uh unique. And of course, in those days, they wanted to make the

1:05:15interiors rather Middle Eastern design, which of

1:05:19course now become much more contemporary. But in those days they

1:05:23became very heavy, very goldplated, very crystals and sometimes they made the

1:05:28airplane so heavy it just they took half the range away from the airplane. Um,

1:05:33but it’s funny most people don’t do things crazy on the airplane. And I try

1:05:38to convince him not to because you it’s not like in a house where you basically

1:05:42can get up and look in another room. You’re stuck looking at that,

1:05:45>> you know, for 10 hours at a time and you can’t get up and move. So you got the

1:05:48roulette wheel just sitting there just spinning around

1:05:52looking at a picture for you know

1:05:54>> Okay. What’s something that you you choose to spend a lot of money on that

1:05:58you feel is completely worth it?

1:06:01>> My summer um

1:06:03>> I I travel a lot in around the Med during the summer. I’m on different

1:06:08yachts um and staying in the best the you know beautiful resorts and between

1:06:14you know Mknos and Sanrope and Monaco and Capri and you know Videst and these

1:06:19kind of places and that’s where most of my clients are.

1:06:24>> So I am I am enjoying my life but I am really working every day of my life

1:06:30every minute of my life just usually from beautiful places and I’m in touch

1:06:34with my a lot. I I spend a lot of money on personal life, but it really is it it

1:06:40overshadows over or it just blends into my business life cuz I I really don’t

1:06:44see I don’t differentiate the two.

1:06:46>> It’s the dream, right? It’s all one. I love it.

1:06:48>> I I I just personally tell people, listen, you know, the true definition of

1:06:52success is when you wake up in the morning and you can’t wait to go to the

1:06:56office and at the end of the day, you can’t wait to get home and see your

1:06:58family. If you if you can have say both those things, you’re a success.

1:07:04>> Yeah. Completely agree. Completely agree. Steve, this was awesome. Uh,

1:07:09where should people connect with you or go to find out more?

1:07:13>> So, my website, the jetbus.com is the best place and I’m easy to find and my

1:07:18email is on there, which is svthejetbus.com.

1:07:21So, I’m happy to and I usually find my phone number and I pick up 24/7. So,

1:07:28unless I’m on a plane or I’m in a meeting like right now or the phone’s

1:07:31been vibrating away here, uh, usually I’ll pick up the phone.

1:07:34>> Yeah, I might add I when I emailed you, you replied really, really fast and I

1:07:38did notice that

1:07:39>> cuz if it gets down too far down the line, I’ll use

1:07:44>> brilliant. Thank you very much. My pleasure. Nice to meet you. Cheers.

1:07:48Thank you.

1:07:48>> Thank you.